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Post by Eni on Jul 8, 2010 17:58:10 GMT
Today is the day to start reading everyone who's got a copy open it and let's see how it goes.
Aim to finish it about the 15th? Although we'll adjust it to how fast/slow people are able to read it.
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Momo
Slightly Addicted
Me and Hannah are awesome. Now go be less awesome than us[M:0]
Everything's gonna be alright.
Posts: 258
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Post by Momo on Jul 8, 2010 18:06:11 GMT
Oh lord, theres sooo many words a page Takes me 1/2 hour to read 15 pages , and there's about 150 or summin
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Post by Michael on Jul 8, 2010 18:14:06 GMT
15th may be a push, but I will try.
*announceitizes*
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Post by Eni on Jul 8, 2010 18:31:52 GMT
It's not /that/ big a book. I will tell you were I get to by tonight ...if it's only a couple pages in I'll push that back XP
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Post by Krackerz on Jul 9, 2010 18:12:51 GMT
I'll start it and attempt to complete it. Though I'm still struggling through the first Lord of the Rings. But I'll try!
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Post by Michael on Jul 9, 2010 19:13:16 GMT
Page 28. Okay, things I noticed: Is the writer gay? He just seems to call the boys "sexy". It's like he's finding it hard to admit... =/. The Secret Goldfish made me laugh, . But the stuff about his brother and a sports car is dream world? Or is it actually real. I'm probably being thick
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Post by Eni on Jul 10, 2010 0:18:21 GMT
Page 28. Okay, things I noticed: Is the writer gay? He just seems to call the boys "sexy". It's like he's finding it hard to admit... =/. The Secret Goldfish made me laugh, . But the stuff about his brother and a sports car is dream world? Or is it actually real. I'm probably being thick I'm pretty sure Salinger isn't gay ...didn't he leave his wife for like a 20 year old girl?
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Post by Michael on Jul 10, 2010 16:04:10 GMT
[spolier]Sorry, I meant the writer as in Holden, not the actual writer.[/spoiler]
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Post by Eni on Jul 12, 2010 8:53:54 GMT
Ok, sorry I wasn't really able to read all week, too many jobs to apply to. So atm am up to page 20 (although I'm sure I can catch up) Firstly let me give you this video of John Green (a young adult author) talking about the first part of CitR. This is part of the reason I wanted to reread it, because he points out so many things I didn't notice the first time. So some observations based on reading up to page 20: The Hunting Cap He newly bought the hunting cap? I didn't remember this. John Green goes on and on about how it's like a security blanket so I assumed he'd had it since he was little, but then I guess it definitely is a comfort thing. He buys it to cheer himself up after he looses the foils. And I guess it's a connection to childhood less in that he had it since childhood but in that it is childish. He admits to himself that it is 'very corny' and then his friend also thinks it's kind of childish to wear this strange hat. Holden I think in general, reading it this time I'm thinking more of Holdon as a teenager with depression. I never considered before but that's probably why he was failing his subjects. Just this idea that when you're depressed you can't commit yourself to anything, you can't work, you don't feel the worth of doing school etc.
I think his depression is also clear in the way he treats his teacher. 'If you thought about him too much, you wondered what the heck he was still living for' p6. I think it shows that he's missing his own reason to live and he projects that onto other people. If he properly thinks about it he can't really see a reason Mr Spencer is still alive. The way he says he lives for buying blankets shows that Holden doesn't think his own reasons for living are very good. Framed Telling I didn't notice until rereading (and John Green's video) that Holden is telling the story a year into the future and I guess what John Green is right in that that is what gives you hope. Because if he's able to sit down and tell the story he can't be as depressed as he was.
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Post by Michael on Jul 12, 2010 15:44:47 GMT
Holden I think in general, reading it this time I'm thinking more of Holdon as a teenager with depression. I never considered before but that's probably why he was failing his subjects. Just this idea that when you're depressed you can't commit yourself to anything, you can't work, you don't feel the worth of doing school etc.
I think his depression is also clear in the way he treats his teacher. 'If you thought about him too much, you wondered what the heck he was still living for' p6. I think it shows that he's missing his own reason to live and he projects that onto other people. If he properly thinks about it he can't really see a reason Mr Spencer is still alive. The way he says he lives for buying blankets shows that Holden doesn't think his own reasons for living are very good. I agree, also his way of repeating sentences after another makes him feel...hopeless in a way. And he says he's "the only useless one in the family", we he says, twice.
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Post by Eni on Jul 12, 2010 21:30:36 GMT
The whole way through he keeps using the words depressed and lonesome. I'm up to page 74 now! Aiming to reach 100 before bed tonight. How's everyone else doing? ...is anyone reading this but apart from me and Michael? XP The Child vs The Adult So what I've finally started to understand is the weird gap Holden feels he's in. He really wants to be a child sometimes, longing for childish things, the great times he has as a child and for his kid sister, then again he also hates it when people think he's young and won't serve him drinks.
Maybe he wants to be a child but his body/situation/life says he can't be. On page 56 he says 'it's really too bad that so much crumby stuff is a lot of fun sometimes'. I think that shows that he wants to do one thing, but finds himself doing something else. Also in general really glad I'm rereading this book. I forgot about everything. Edit: Look I've started making notes because I foret what to say when I come to post XP
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Post by Michael on Jul 13, 2010 16:42:44 GMT
I think it's just us; lazy people. I'm on page 95 I must admit I'm getting /slightly/ bored with the book, it's like swings and roundabouts. I suppose this is meant to show how lost he feels in his life at the moment. I agree with you; he wants to return to his childhood where he was all innocent. Like, for example, DB and his stories. Now he has to face that DB's a prostitute.
The protistue thing (her and Holden in the hotel) was weird, did you understand it? Or have you not got that far...
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Post by Eni on Jul 13, 2010 21:42:25 GMT
DB You know DB isn't really a prostitute right? Holden just refers to him as that because he's a sell out, no longer trying to right good stories, instead he's trying to sell cheesy stories to Hollywood so as to make money. The prostitute Yeah, I did find that weird. Not really sure what to make of it. I took what John Green said above that it just highlights how awful and lonely Holden is feeling that not even a prostitute wants to talk to him.
I think it also highlights a) his mood swings, constantly wanting to do something but deciding not to just as he's about to and b) his mixed feelings on love. There's a quote which kinda explains the prostitute situation a bit, I'll put it below with a page number though just in case you're not that far Page 133 "You know what the trouble with me is? I can never get really sexy - I mean really sexy - with a girl I don't like a lot. I mean I have to like her a lot. If I don't, I sort of loose my goddamn desire for her and all. Boy, it really screws up my sex life something awful. My sex life stinks." So yeah, I think it's just Holden desperately wanting to connect with people, desperately wanting to find someone he can talk to, someone who understands him and also battling with hormones that make him fall in love with every girl he meets. (Page 113) Like he does with Sally Hayes I know what you mean about the book being dull in points. I lump it in with classics, classics aren't fun to read, but they tell an important message or something. This isn't a book that's exciting, or full of suspense, or characters you love, but I think it's a really good book about depression and teenage angst. I'm up to page 163, I had a long coach journey today with nothing to do but read. Might finish it tonight, although might be difficult, am staying with a friend.
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Post by Eni on Jul 14, 2010 13:13:37 GMT
Finished! Not sure I really got the last scene with Phoebe. He had this fantasy to run away and live this fantasy life in the woods and then Phoebe ruined it by wanting to come with him. Because when she did it made him realise how unfeasible it actually was. Maybe.
And the significance of Phoebe putting the hat on him? Maybe she's trying to protect him now instead of the other way round.
And he's happy at the end as he watches her on the merry-go-round. Is it aiming at a cyclic idea? That he's happy because even though he's no longer a child, and can no longer go on things like merry-go-rounds there will always be children with their childish happiness. Page 170 I never realised before how much this is addressing the reader. Mr Antolini's speech is basically directed straight at the reader, it's directly stating what The Catcher in the Rye is;
'Many, many men have been just as troubled morally and spiritually as you are right now. Happily some of them keep records of their troubles. You'll learn from them - if you want to.' Also end of The Catcher in the Rye video!
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Post by Michael on Jul 15, 2010 19:45:59 GMT
I'm only on page 123, so I won't open the other spoilers yet. xD
I can something to say to this and I have completely forgotten. =(
I think he feels so depressed that he couldn't do it, and it sort of makes himself feel/appear hopeless.
The theatre with Sally is another sign of his depressed and extremely twisted mind at the moment. The way he seems to want to rush away with her, although he clearly states that he didn't really like her much anyway. His feelings/choices change so much. Confuses me!
I'm gonna read more tonight and make notes, because i've forgotten everything and the above doesn't really make a huge amount of sense.
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